(03-15-2024, 04:30 AM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 04:21 AM)Craigukjag Wrote: [ -> ]At the risk of getting into a debate I don’t wanna get into, there’s no doubt hutch is a better pass rusher. But I have no problems with walker at all. Much better against the run and as he develops will become more and more versatile. I have no issues with picking him over hutch.
As for lloyd he has struggled but it’s hard to criticise the front office for that, majority of this board and fan base were thrilled when they picked him. Everyone thought we were getting a difference maker. It seemed a very safe pick at the time Sometimes players just don’t live up to what you had hoped.
Lloyd was second on the team in tackling. Maybe he can be utilized more effectively in 2024 with a new scheme and coaches. I would like to see him get used on a blitz some. Now muma had like 7 tackles last season. He’s looking like a Huge bust.
I wasn’t calling lloyd a bust I like him just at this time is falling short of what we were hoping for. But absolutely believe he’ll continue to improve. I was just saying it’s hard to critique the front office if you believe lloyd is a bust mainly because majority of us were happy when he made it.
(03-15-2024, 05:39 AM)Craigukjag Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 04:30 AM)Jag88 Wrote: [ -> ]Lloyd was second on the team in tackling. Maybe he can be utilized more effectively in 2024 with a new scheme and coaches. I would like to see him get used on a blitz some. Now muma had like 7 tackles last season. He’s looking like a Huge bust.
I wasn’t calling lloyd a bust I like him just at this time is falling short of what we were hoping for. But absolutely believe he’ll continue to improve. I was just saying it’s hard to critique the front office if you believe lloyd is a bust mainly because majority of us were happy when he made it.
Lloyd struggled his rookie season but started catching on early in year two. Had it not been for his injury to his hand I think he would have had a better overall season. He had thumb surgery earlier on and then had to play with a cast.
I recall him making a number of plays on the football and he probably would have hauled in more interceptions like he did during his rookie season. With a hopefully improved front four he'll have more opportunities to make those types of plays.
(03-15-2024, 04:13 AM)wassy04 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-14-2024, 11:05 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]It's even better when you include the second 1s like you did. Some people are so traumatized by the past the they can't see the present.
Not "plus", it was a very ignorant statement.
You can't really give him credit for picking Trevor with the 1.01 surely?
Etienne has done well and Anton looks to be a pretty good pick. Lloyd and Walker can't exactly be considered hits, particularly when you consider opportunity cost of what was required to get them. (In Walker's case turning down a bunch of players that have done better than him so far in his career)
Picking Walker over Hutch is a pretty clear error at this point, do people not agree?
Absolutely he gets credit for picking Trevor. He could have not picked Trevor.
Walker over Hutch after last season is not a clear error. After their rookie year maybe, but as expected Hutch was ready to go out of the gate. Walker seems to be getting their. But the point remains Walker looks like a good, foundational player, that is all you ask.
Lloyd was quite good towards the end of last season. Zero of those picks are busts.
(03-15-2024, 05:16 AM)MikePete54 Wrote: [ -> ]It's hard to imagine a way to grab Aiyuk tbh.
We will probably have to trade our 1st rd pick and then sign him to a huge contract.
I may be wrong, but he is probably using the Jags interest to force the 49ers to give him big money.
Idk. Keenan Allen just went to the Bears for only a 4th and he’s been more productive/consistent than Aiyuk. He does have that injury history and a little older but he’s always been a top tier WR. I would have given a 4th for Allen over signing Gabe
I think Aiyuk can be had for a 2nd at most. Probably even a 3rd and mid round next year. Brian Burns is a top pass rusher and went for a 2nd and a 5th and is a more premium position than WR in a deep draft class that will drive his value down to trade this year
(03-15-2024, 07:23 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 05:16 AM)MikePete54 Wrote: [ -> ]It's hard to imagine a way to grab Aiyuk tbh.
We will probably have to trade our 1st rd pick and then sign him to a huge contract.
I may be wrong, but he is probably using the Jags interest to force the 49ers to give him big money.
Idk. Keenan Allen just went to the Bears for only a 4th and he’s been more productive/consistent than Aiyuk. He does have that injury history and a little older but he’s always been a top tier WR. I would have given a 4th for Allen over signing Gabe
I think Aiyuk can be had for a 2nd at most. Probably even a 3rd and mid round next year. Brian Burns is a top pass rusher and went for a 2nd and a 5th and is a more premium position than WR in a deep draft class that will drive his value down to trade this year
Some people are throwing out a 1st round pick swap (17 for 31), a 4th and a 2025 3rd.
Which I would 100% do. I’m not sure if some people realize how good Aiyuk actually is.
(03-15-2024, 04:21 AM)Craigukjag Wrote: [ -> ]At the risk of getting into a debate I don’t wanna get into, there’s no doubt hutch is a better pass rusher. But I have no problems with walker at all. Much better against the run and as he develops will become more and more versatile. I have no issues with picking him over hutch.
As for lloyd he has struggled but it’s hard to criticise the front office for that, majority of this board and fan base were thrilled when they picked him. Everyone thought we were getting a difference maker. It seemed a very safe pick at the time Sometimes players just don’t live up to what you had hoped.
I Concur to ALL of the above especially your point of respectfully constantly debating. Hutchinson does have better pass rushing/sack numbers while we didn't draft Walker to be an pure pass rusher/sack specialist. It was clear when we drafted him that the team's desire was for him to set the edge and be an good run stopper for our defense. Mission Accomplished.
Lloyd came out of the box extremely slow to which Muma was inserted until he, Lloyd got acclimated to the NFL speed. His performance last season prevented Muma from seeing the field respectfully speaking. Another Mission Accomplished.
I feel that Walker, Lloyd and Muma will play an vital part in our new defensive scheme as we revert back to an 4-3 defense.
Time Will Tell.
NH3...
(03-14-2024, 05:00 PM)Jags32250 Wrote: [ -> ]So… everyone’s back to happy? Some of y’all are ridiculous.
Blessing Ridley went to TN, this is the perfect scenario.
I'm nervous. We are spending a LOT, probably the big swing while Trevor is still cheap. If we don't go on a deep postseason run, it will seem wasteful.
But yeah, I guess banking on comp picks for losing Ridley is out the door now!
(03-14-2024, 05:43 PM)RicoTx Wrote: [ -> ]Don’t want any more FA or trades after Armstead. Time to draft and develop.
I think the Armstead acquisition gives us a lot of flexibility with our first pick. Really hoping for IOL or WR, although I wouldn’t be upset with another DL, edge or CB. No matter who, want to see someone that is a day one starter and impact player.
This. We can literally take any position now because they are top of the board, high value position, and not reaching to fill glaring need.
I think our most desperate hole right now is....kicker?
(03-14-2024, 05:44 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Texans are paying Mixon more than what Henry is making lol
Mixon is younger? Henry might be relegated to parttime status at this stage. Lotta miles.
(03-15-2024, 07:52 AM)Mikey Wrote: [ -> ] (03-14-2024, 05:43 PM)RicoTx Wrote: [ -> ]Don’t want any more FA or trades after Armstead. Time to draft and develop.
I think the Armstead acquisition gives us a lot of flexibility with our first pick. Really hoping for IOL or WR, although I wouldn’t be upset with another DL, edge or CB. No matter who, want to see someone that is a day one starter and impact player.
This. We can literally take any position now because they are top of the board, high value position, and not reaching to fill glaring need.
I think our most desperate hole right now is....kicker?
(03-14-2024, 05:44 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Texans are paying Mixon more than what Henry is making lol
Mixon is younger? Henry might be relegated to parttime status at this stage. Lotta miles.
I think we could really use a premium CB. If there is one available at pick #17, I think we should pick him. I was so envious of Kansas City's secondary during the playoffs.
(03-14-2024, 06:10 PM)NCJAGFAN1949 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-14-2024, 06:00 PM)RicoTx Wrote: [ -> ]…because a message board is always the best place for accurate information.
Never claimed it was accurate, bozo. Just passing the info along. What is accurate is the long history this team has of giving big contracts to over-the-hill players who come to Jax to retire.
...which of those happened under this regime?
It's ok to let the outdated narratives die.
(03-15-2024, 07:35 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 07:23 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ]Idk. Keenan Allen just went to the Bears for only a 4th and he’s been more productive/consistent than Aiyuk. He does have that injury history and a little older but he’s always been a top tier WR. I would have given a 4th for Allen over signing Gabe
I think Aiyuk can be had for a 2nd at most. Probably even a 3rd and mid round next year. Brian Burns is a top pass rusher and went for a 2nd and a 5th and is a more premium position than WR in a deep draft class that will drive his value down to trade this year
Some people are throwing out a 1st round pick swap (17 for 31), a 4th and a 2025 3rd.
Which I would 100% do. I’m not sure if some people realize how good Aiyuk actually is.
I would do it, no question. Aiyuk is the reason why Pudry was good this season.
(03-14-2024, 06:50 PM)NCJAGFAN1949 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-14-2024, 06:23 PM)RicoTx Wrote: [ -> ]I’m a bozo and you use it to ‘support’ your statement of signing over the hill players who come to Jax to retire. LOL. What a nitwit.
So, I’m the nitwit, huh? Do these names ring a bell for you? Jared Odrick, 2015, 5 years, $42.5 million. Released in 2017, never played another down in the NFL again. How about Hugh Douglas? 2003, 5 years, $27 million……played one year in Jax, later admitted he “ stole “ the money from the Jags. Or how about Aaron Kampman? 4 years, $25 million…..played 2 years, was cut, never played another down in the NFL. Then there was Jerry Porter…..6 years, $30 million. Cut after one season. Nick Foles, 2019, 4 years, $88 million…..played FOUR GAMES. I could go on and on with the list. I guess you can’t fix stupid, huh?
Let's see...Baalke was not the GM in 2015....not in 2003.....didn't sign Kampman to that deal...wasn't involved in the Porter signing (91 % sure about that), Foles got Coughlin axed (among other things, and again, not a Baalke deal)
stupid, indeed. Oh BTW, you forgot Aaron Ross, but again, wasn't signed by our current GM.
You could play this damn game with every frickin team. Teams sign older guys. Sometimes they play like Calais, other times they play like Jamaal Charles (who remembers he was a Jag?).
(03-15-2024, 07:35 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 07:23 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ]Idk. Keenan Allen just went to the Bears for only a 4th and he’s been more productive/consistent than Aiyuk. He does have that injury history and a little older but he’s always been a top tier WR. I would have given a 4th for Allen over signing Gabe
I think Aiyuk can be had for a 2nd at most. Probably even a 3rd and mid round next year. Brian Burns is a top pass rusher and went for a 2nd and a 5th and is a more premium position than WR in a deep draft class that will drive his value down to trade this year
Some people are throwing out a 1st round pick swap (17 for 31), a 4th and a 2025 3rd.
Which I would 100% do. I’m not sure if some people realize how good Aiyuk actually is.
I would do that deal. The benefit we have is that his production has been capped in that offense by no fault of his own, combined with a deep class of WRs, and the fact that we could argue we need to get an extension done. You either do this trade now or not at all really, his value will only go up from here.
(03-15-2024, 08:03 AM)MikePete54 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 07:35 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Some people are throwing out a 1st round pick swap (17 for 31), a 4th and a 2025 3rd.
Which I would 100% do. I’m not sure if some people realize how good Aiyuk actually is.
I would do it, no question. Aiyuk is the reason why Pudry was good this season.
I think the main contributor to Purdy's success is the 49ers running game. Trevor had to deal with 2nd and 12 while Purdy had 2nd and 5. There's so much more chance of success with 2nd and 5 as opposed to 2nd and 12.
As for trading for Aiyuk, not only would we have to give up a premium draft pick or picks, we'd also have to sign Aiyuk to a new contract, since 2024 is the last year of his current deal. That's too much to give up.
(03-15-2024, 04:13 AM)wassy04 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-14-2024, 11:05 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]It's even better when you include the second 1s like you did. Some people are so traumatized by the past the they can't see the present.
Not "plus", it was a very ignorant statement.
You can't really give him credit for picking Trevor with the 1.01 surely?
Etienne has done well and Anton looks to be a pretty good pick. Lloyd and Walker can't exactly be considered hits, particularly when you consider opportunity cost of what was required to get them. (In Walker's case turning down a bunch of players that have done better than him so far in his career)
Picking Walker over Hutch is a pretty clear error at this point, do people not agree?
Stop. Give the guy credit when he makes a good call. I didnt want Walker for that reason, but after year two Walker has closed the gap. Walker is progressing as they pretty much said he would and he caught up to Hutchinson last year. This year I expect to see Travon take the big jump and, hopefully, it will be clear that he was the right pick.
(03-15-2024, 08:03 AM)MikePete54 Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 07:35 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]Some people are throwing out a 1st round pick swap (17 for 31), a 4th and a 2025 3rd.
Which I would 100% do. I’m not sure if some people realize how good Aiyuk actually is.
I would do it, no question. Aiyuk is the reason why Pudry was good this season.
His offensive line is why Purdy was good.
(03-15-2024, 07:23 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 05:16 AM)MikePete54 Wrote: [ -> ]It's hard to imagine a way to grab Aiyuk tbh.
We will probably have to trade our 1st rd pick and then sign him to a huge contract.
I may be wrong, but he is probably using the Jags interest to force the 49ers to give him big money.
Idk. Keenan Allen just went to the Bears for only a 4th and he’s been more productive/consistent than Aiyuk. He does have that injury history and a little older but he’s always been a top tier WR. I would have given a 4th for Allen over signing Gabe
I think Aiyuk can be had for a 2nd at most. Probably even a 3rd and mid round next year. Brian Burns is a top pass rusher and went for a 2nd and a 5th and is a more premium position than WR in a deep draft class that will drive his value down to trade this year
Keenan Allen will be 32 years old this season. It's quite possible he begins fading into irrelevancy this year or soon after. I don't know if Aiyuk can be had for what you list, but as I've stated previously, our 3rd this year and maybe another late pick this year or mid pick next year is all I would offer with no expectations that such an offer would be accepted. Otherwise I watch how the top 10 picks in the draft unfold and if Odunze isn't gone by the top 6-7 picks, I start making calls to see what it would cost to come up. I think Odunze will be the 2nd receiver picked behind Harrison and probably will be gone by that point. I wouldn't trade up for Nabers. If he's there at 17 I'd consider it, but he shouldn't be.
(03-15-2024, 07:35 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (03-15-2024, 07:23 AM)imtheblkranger Wrote: [ -> ]Idk. Keenan Allen just went to the Bears for only a 4th and he’s been more productive/consistent than Aiyuk. He does have that injury history and a little older but he’s always been a top tier WR. I would have given a 4th for Allen over signing Gabe
I think Aiyuk can be had for a 2nd at most. Probably even a 3rd and mid round next year. Brian Burns is a top pass rusher and went for a 2nd and a 5th and is a more premium position than WR in a deep draft class that will drive his value down to trade this year
Some people are throwing out a 1st round pick swap (17 for 31), a 4th and a 2025 3rd.
Which I would 100% do. I’m not sure if some people realize how good Aiyuk actually is.
Nah, the wide receiver market has settled. No one else is going to give all that to the 49ers, especially as the draft nears and all the talented WR prospects get hyped more. I'd wait and offer only #17 or Cam Robinson + ham sandwich.