(04-04-2024, 12:11 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LOL
Fans are hellbent on making this roster out to be garbage for some reason.
I think we are only a few pieces away from having a good battle for the AFCS with the tinhorns for the foreseeable future.
I don't see the doom and gloom.
Need more young talent on OL, DL, and WR.
CB is a perceived need understandably - but we really have no idea what the current unit is going to look like in the new scheme just yet. A draft pick there is as much about 2025 as it is 2024 IMO.
I'll also continue to point out that the past two drafts have been a collaboration between Pederson and Baalke and everyone keeps putting it all on Baalke.
If Cleveland and Morse turn out to be enough change to get run functionality back from our OL, we will see a radical change in production that doesn't require a first round WR pick. I'm not concerned about the offense beyond the OL. The line is what screwed them last year.
If I'm prioritizing needs for this roster I'm going:
IDL - get me a 300+ lb NT/DT to rotate with Hamilton
IOL - Get me a guard to push and eventually replace Scherff
CB - No long term sure fire solutions on the roster - need young talent to sustain new scheme - Campbell is a question mark in new scheme
WR - need young talent to sustain cap at position
LT - seems we'll put off fixing this until next year - that's acceptable IMO, but it has to get right
Of all of these - IDL is the only one that seems like a dire immediate need.
The bolded is my main gripe and always has been.
Those are 4 of the most important positions in football outside of QB. And they are still needs. They have no sure fire young talent at those positions. They still aren't sure if Campbell is an answer at CB. No young IOL and just one on the entire starting 5 (Anton). Zero young WR talent when you have a young franchise QB. They have no youth on the IDL either (Especially with Hamilton being a ?).
I want better drafts with players deserving of second contracts. At this moment, the Jags have very few of those. Trevor, Travon, and Anton are the only surefire young players I would give a second contract to.
(04-04-2024, 12:11 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LOL
Fans are hellbent on making this roster out to be garbage for some reason.
I think we are only a few pieces away from having a good battle for the AFCS with the tinhorns for the foreseeable future.
I don't see the doom and gloom.
Need more young talent on OL, DL, and WR.
CB is a perceived need understandably - but we really have no idea what the current unit is going to look like in the new scheme just yet. A draft pick there is as much about 2025 as it is 2024 IMO.
I'll also continue to point out that the past two drafts have been a collaboration between Pederson and Baalke and everyone keeps putting it all on Baalke.
If Cleveland and Morse turn out to be enough change to get run functionality back from our OL, we will see a radical change in production that doesn't require a first round WR pick. I'm not concerned about the offense beyond the OL. The line is what screwed them last year.
If I'm prioritizing needs for this roster I'm going:
IDL - get me a 300+ lb NT/DT to rotate with Hamilton
IOL - Get me a guard to push and eventually replace Scherff
CB - No long term sure fire solutions on the roster - need young talent to sustain new scheme - Campbell is a question mark in new scheme
WR - need young talent to sustain cap at position
LT - seems we'll put off fixing this until next year - that's acceptable IMO, but it has to get right
Of all of these - IDL is the only one that seems like a dire immediate need.
You don’t think IOL is the most dire? Trevor’s health, the run game and our offense overall suffered mightily in the 2nd half of the season because of a weak middle and left side.
We picked up Morse but he’s just a patch for now and I’m not very confident with Cam.
(04-04-2024, 12:22 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 12:11 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LOL
Fans are hellbent on making this roster out to be garbage for some reason.
I think we are only a few pieces away from having a good battle for the AFCS with the tinhorns for the foreseeable future.
I don't see the doom and gloom.
Need more young talent on OL, DL, and WR.
CB is a perceived need understandably - but we really have no idea what the current unit is going to look like in the new scheme just yet. A draft pick there is as much about 2025 as it is 2024 IMO.
I'll also continue to point out that the past two drafts have been a collaboration between Pederson and Baalke and everyone keeps putting it all on Baalke.
If Cleveland and Morse turn out to be enough change to get run functionality back from our OL, we will see a radical change in production that doesn't require a first round WR pick. I'm not concerned about the offense beyond the OL. The line is what screwed them last year.
If I'm prioritizing needs for this roster I'm going:
IDL - get me a 300+ lb NT/DT to rotate with Hamilton
IOL - Get me a guard to push and eventually replace Scherff
CB - No long term sure fire solutions on the roster - need young talent to sustain new scheme - Campbell is a question mark in new scheme
WR - need young talent to sustain cap at position
LT - seems we'll put off fixing this until next year - that's acceptable IMO, but it has to get right
Of all of these - IDL is the only one that seems like a dire immediate need.
The bolded is my main gripe and always has been.
Those are 4 of the most important positions in football outside of QB. And they are still needs. They have no sure fire young talent at those positions. They still aren't sure if Campbell is an answer at CB. No young IOL and just one on the entire starting 5 (Anton). Zero young WR talent when you have a young franchise QB. They have no youth on the IDL either (Especially with Hamilton being a ?).
I want better drafts with players deserving of second contracts. At this moment, the Jags have very few of those. Trevor, Travon, and Anton are the only surefire young players I would give a second contract to.
Given the current trends of talent coming out of the NCAA - young IDL talent is the only one of those that should be any challenge to draft IMO.
They have relied too heavily on free agency and now they have the challenge of making sure they have a young piece added to 3 or 4 different position groups for sustainability - but it is doable.
The Campbell thing is more about injury and a scheme change. We know he's very talented. He may adapt well this year after getting healed up. I don't see how you put that on the FO. The FO acquired a gifted CB in the second round. Lots of good ones to choose from in the latest crop as well.
WR needs youth. OK. Lots of good ones in this draft. Just pick one that makes sense at your selection or maneuver if you absolutely must.
Finding a quality OG/C should absolutely not be too difficult in this draft or the next and it shouldn't require more than a 2nd or 3rd rd pick.
(04-04-2024, 12:26 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 12:11 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]LOL
Fans are hellbent on making this roster out to be garbage for some reason.
I think we are only a few pieces away from having a good battle for the AFCS with the tinhorns for the foreseeable future.
I don't see the doom and gloom.
Need more young talent on OL, DL, and WR.
CB is a perceived need understandably - but we really have no idea what the current unit is going to look like in the new scheme just yet. A draft pick there is as much about 2025 as it is 2024 IMO.
I'll also continue to point out that the past two drafts have been a collaboration between Pederson and Baalke and everyone keeps putting it all on Baalke.
If Cleveland and Morse turn out to be enough change to get run functionality back from our OL, we will see a radical change in production that doesn't require a first round WR pick. I'm not concerned about the offense beyond the OL. The line is what screwed them last year.
If I'm prioritizing needs for this roster I'm going:
IDL - get me a 300+ lb NT/DT to rotate with Hamilton
IOL - Get me a guard to push and eventually replace Scherff
CB - No long term sure fire solutions on the roster - need young talent to sustain new scheme - Campbell is a question mark in new scheme
WR - need young talent to sustain cap at position
LT - seems we'll put off fixing this until next year - that's acceptable IMO, but it has to get right
Of all of these - IDL is the only one that seems like a dire immediate need.
You don’t think IOL is the most dire? Trevor’s health, the run game and our offense overall suffered mightily in the 2nd half of the season because of a weak middle and left side.
We picked up Morse but he’s just a patch for now and I’m not very confident with Cam.
They patched the Center and they added a LG who has good tape from his last stop.
Give those 2 an offseason together - and they should make a difference in the run game and elevate protection a notch. That could radically move our offense forward compared to last year. Fingers crossed it is enough.
I still want an interior guy drafted before round 5.
I'd fix LT next year.
All they've done to assuage my fears for IDL is add an aging pressure specialist at 3Tech who probably won't play 17 games due to foot and knee history.
They let go their "run stuffer" NT/DT when his performance fell off after getting paid. Haven't replaced him.
The primary nose tackle has no one to rotate with and is coming off a horrible performance when he returned from a sever spinal infection.
The rotating cast behind those two is completely uninspiring.
RRH looked lost last season after also getting paid.
Gotsis is a lunchpail motor guy that is good for some decent snaps but won't impact more than one or two games for you.
Ledbetter is a phone booth - and not a very large or impressive one.
They need young talent in the middle of that line and they need Hamilton to bounce back strong.
It's a bigger concern to me.
IOL is right behind it, but they have done some work there at least.
(04-04-2024, 01:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 12:22 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]The bolded is my main gripe and always has been.
Those are 4 of the most important positions in football outside of QB. And they are still needs. They have no sure fire young talent at those positions. They still aren't sure if Campbell is an answer at CB. No young IOL and just one on the entire starting 5 (Anton). Zero young WR talent when you have a young franchise QB. They have no youth on the IDL either (Especially with Hamilton being a ?).
I want better drafts with players deserving of second contracts. At this moment, the Jags have very few of those. Trevor, Travon, and Anton are the only surefire young players I would give a second contract to.
Given the current trends of talent coming out of the NCAA - young IDL talent is the only one of those that should be any challenge to draft IMO.
They have relied too heavily on free agency and now they have the challenge of making sure they have a young piece added to 3 or 4 different position groups for sustainability - but it is doable.
The Campbell thing is more about injury and a scheme change. We know he's very talented. He may adapt well this year after getting healed up. I don't see how you put that on the FO. The FO acquired a gifted CB in the second round. Lots of good ones to choose from in the latest crop as well.
WR needs youth. OK. Lots of good ones in this draft. Just pick one that makes sense at your selection or maneuver if you absolutely must.
Finding a quality OG/C should absolutely not be too difficult in this draft or the next and it shouldn't require more than a 2nd or 3rd rd pick.
You're right. It shouldn't be too difficult and yet here we are... Same spot we have been in for 4+ years. No young IOL.
I know the solutions are easy. However the Jags have a GM who has consistently shown he does not know how to draft past round 1.
Maybe he shocks the world and hits on rounds 2-3. Or maybe, his trend continues.....
Guess we find out in 3 weeks.
(04-04-2024, 01:26 PM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 01:06 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Given the current trends of talent coming out of the NCAA - young IDL talent is the only one of those that should be any challenge to draft IMO.
They have relied too heavily on free agency and now they have the challenge of making sure they have a young piece added to 3 or 4 different position groups for sustainability - but it is doable.
The Campbell thing is more about injury and a scheme change. We know he's very talented. He may adapt well this year after getting healed up. I don't see how you put that on the FO. The FO acquired a gifted CB in the second round. Lots of good ones to choose from in the latest crop as well.
WR needs youth. OK. Lots of good ones in this draft. Just pick one that makes sense at your selection or maneuver if you absolutely must.
Finding a quality OG/C should absolutely not be too difficult in this draft or the next and it shouldn't require more than a 2nd or 3rd rd pick.
You're right. It shouldn't be too difficult and yet here we are... Same spot we have been in for 4+ years. No young IOL.
I know the solutions are easy. However the Jags have a GM who has consistently shown he does not know how to draft past round 1.
Maybe he shocks the world and hits on rounds 2-3. Or maybe, his trend continues.....
Guess we find out in 3 weeks.
They whiffed on Fortner and hoped Bartch would turn into something but he got hurt instead.
[BLEEP] happens. I hate that they didn't do more last year on the OL more than any fan I know - but I don't think it should be too tough to get it right. And the two FA signings are a nice start.
What trend?
One draft?
We don't know what the 2023 class is yet. So you're going on 2022?
I'm not gonna sit here and blindly assume that Baalke and Pederson can't come away with 3or 4 starters/contributors in this draft because I don't love their 2022 draft.
It's a crapshoot just like it is every year.
Bud Dupree would still be a great free agent Edge signing. Then draft corner, WR and O-line...imo.
One thing that concerns me is by all accounts this defensive scheme seems to be very corner dependent… I do worry about our overall talent level at that position.. as already mentioned several times our best corner Tyson Campbell is still a question mark in terms of reliability.. with all the great receivers in our division this seems to be a major hole for us.
I am aware this is a great receiver draft . And we still have a few good vets for a few more years at this position that this would seem to be a good time to take one and have him learn the ropes from a veteran room.
I don’t know how our draft will shake out but I agree that our middle rounds need to be o line d line focused .
I guess I’m interested to see who our front office values in the mid first round as most immediate impact.
My money is on corner 1st - receiver 2nd then hopefully trenches the rest of the way .
(04-04-2024, 03:16 PM)TTechJag85 Wrote: [ -> ]One thing that concerns me is by all accounts this defensive scheme seems to be very corner dependent… I do worry about our overall talent level at that position.. as already mentioned several times our best corner Tyson Campbell is still a question mark in terms of reliability.. with all the great receivers in our division this seems to be a major hole for us.
I am aware this is a great receiver draft . And we still have a few good vets for a few more years at this position that this would seem to be a good time to take one and have him learn the ropes from a veteran room.
I don’t know how our draft will shake out but I agree that our middle rounds need to be o line d line focused .
I guess I’m interested to see who our front office values in the mid first round as most immediate impact.
My money is on corner 1st - receiver 2nd then hopefully trenches the rest of the way .
They have a mini camp in two weeks.
Whether or not the new staff believes Campbell is a viable candidate to play outside in this scheme that demands more man coverage will be quickly determined at that point IMO.
That will affect draft decisions, but they could still get a corner even if they like Campbell there. Darby's deal isn't a long term one and nickel isn't exactly "solved" by Savage signing even if he's penciled in there.
As far as the scheme being "corner dependent" I think Nielsen correctly pointed out that it is equally dependent upon pressure. The man coverage can't hold up consistently without it. Which is yet another reason why I have IDL as a chief concern. We have exactly one guy who gets pressure from the interior and he's old and somewhat hobbled.
Need more.
(04-04-2024, 03:39 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 03:16 PM)TTechJag85 Wrote: [ -> ]One thing that concerns me is by all accounts this defensive scheme seems to be very corner dependent… I do worry about our overall talent level at that position.. as already mentioned several times our best corner Tyson Campbell is still a question mark in terms of reliability.. with all the great receivers in our division this seems to be a major hole for us.
I am aware this is a great receiver draft . And we still have a few good vets for a few more years at this position that this would seem to be a good time to take one and have him learn the ropes from a veteran room.
I don’t know how our draft will shake out but I agree that our middle rounds need to be o line d line focused .
I guess I’m interested to see who our front office values in the mid first round as most immediate impact.
My money is on corner 1st - receiver 2nd then hopefully trenches the rest of the way .
They have a mini camp in two weeks.
Whether or not the new staff believes Campbell is a viable candidate to play outside in this scheme that demands more man coverage will be quickly determined at that point IMO.
That will affect draft decisions, but they could still get a corner even if they like Campbell there. Darby's deal isn't a long term one and nickel isn't exactly "solved" by Savage signing even if he's penciled in there.
As far as the scheme being "corner dependent" I think Nielsen correctly pointed out that it is equally dependent upon pressure. The man coverage can't hold up consistently without it. Which is yet another reason why I have IDL as a chief concern. We have exactly one guy who gets pressure from the interior and he's old and somewhat hobbled.
Need more.
I can’t argue with the logic.. I agree that both interior lines for us is full of older players and need upgrades.. I think corner is also a big need for us like you mentioned… it’s tough because I suppose we are in this predicament because of poor drafting .. in two years this roster will
Be bare but I’m sure Pederson and Balke arent worried about that… they need answers to win now and so we seem to have a lot of stopgap players who’s health and production have been up and down in recent years .
Top immediate needs for this year.
1. Corner.
2. DT
3. Edge
4. WR
5. G
Quote:NYC4Jags: they added a LG who has good tape from his last stop.
Is this the re-signing of Cleveland? The way it's phrased sounds like a new player that I can't find.
(04-04-2024, 04:42 PM)TTechJag85 Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 03:39 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]They have a mini camp in two weeks.
Whether or not the new staff believes Campbell is a viable candidate to play outside in this scheme that demands more man coverage will be quickly determined at that point IMO.
That will affect draft decisions, but they could still get a corner even if they like Campbell there. Darby's deal isn't a long term one and nickel isn't exactly "solved" by Savage signing even if he's penciled in there.
As far as the scheme being "corner dependent" I think Nielsen correctly pointed out that it is equally dependent upon pressure. The man coverage can't hold up consistently without it. Which is yet another reason why I have IDL as a chief concern. We have exactly one guy who gets pressure from the interior and he's old and somewhat hobbled.
Need more.
I can’t argue with the logic.. I agree that both interior lines for us is full of older players and need upgrades.. I think corner is also a big need for us like you mentioned… it’s tough because I suppose we are in this predicament because of poor drafting .. in two years this roster will
Be bare but I’m sure Pederson and Balke arent worried about that… they need answers to win now and so we seem to have a lot of stopgap players who’s health and production have been up and down in recent years .
When Baalke took over - the team had a ton of cap space and an owner willing to spend plus a young talented QB available with a #1 pick in hand.
It makes sense they went a bit nuts in free agency to build around the QB that was available given that perfect storm scenario.
But, yes, the time is nigh that they hit on some more draft picks and develop some of their current youth into sustainable roster talent.
Right now the team has around 12 players drafted by the current FO who are either starters or
figure to be contributors if all goes well this year. That number needs to increase with the 2024 draft class.
(04-04-2024, 04:57 PM)cland Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:NYC4Jags: they added a LG who has good tape from his last stop.
Is this the re-signing of Cleveland? The way it's phrased sounds like a new player that I can't find.
Cleveland.
Mid-season trade now re-signed. Played hurt in 2023.
(04-04-2024, 05:06 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Gave up a 2nd for a 1 year rental
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/...gr%5Etweet
tinhorn fans are arguing that they'll get a 3rd round comp pick after this season if he leaves. That's a MIGHT get a comp pick and it MIGHT be as high as a 3rd rounder. A lot left to be determined this year before that is determined and there are a lot of scenarios where the 3rd round comp pick doesn't happen. They're taking a big swing this year. We'll see how it works out. I still say we're winning the division.
(04-04-2024, 05:10 PM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 05:06 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Gave up a 2nd for a 1 year rental
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/...gr%5Etweet
tinhorn fans are arguing that they'll get a 3rd round comp pick after this season if he leaves. That's a MIGHT get a comp pick and it MIGHT be as high as a 3rd rounder. A lot left to be determined this year before that is determined and there are a lot of scenarios where the 3rd round comp pick doesn't happen. They're taking a big swing this year. We'll see how it works out. I still say we're winning the division.
Not gonna say that until i see our draft.
Calling it now. Davis will have a better season than Diggs
(04-04-2024, 05:10 PM)Jaguarmeister Wrote: [ -> ] (04-04-2024, 05:06 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Gave up a 2nd for a 1 year rental
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/...gr%5Etweet
tinhorn fans are arguing that they'll get a 3rd round comp pick after this season if he leaves. That's a MIGHT get a comp pick and it MIGHT be as high as a 3rd rounder. A lot left to be determined this year before that is determined and there are a lot of scenarios where the 3rd round comp pick doesn't happen. They're taking a big swing this year. We'll see how it works out. I still say we're winning the division.
He's their Calvin Ridley. Hopefully the result is the same for them.
And yes, the Jags are winning the AFC South. I'm putting $$$ on it right after the draft.
(04-04-2024, 06:37 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ]Calling it now. Davis will have a better season than Diggs
You may as well say "Trevor will have a better season than CJ Stroud". We can hope that Gabe is more productive...but TREVOR being better than CJ is without question the number one need.
(04-04-2024, 03:10 PM)AnOldBrownie Wrote: [ -> ]Bud Dupree would still be a great free agent Edge signing. Then draft corner, WR and O-line...imo.
At this point, there's no rush. Let the darft settle things out and we can finish patchwork at that time.