(12-21-2021, 07:41 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 01:26 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ]Since the non-GMO blooded won't be dying, look for the definition of vaccinated to change quickly to mean only booster every X months.
Wondering if travel will be shutdown. Doing it on Tuesday gives them time to dump or short airline stocks.
Study out of Oxford using 6 months of data shows 1 in 100 chance of myocarditis or other heart issues after vaccination. They took the hospitalizations and reason, then looked at the vaccination status, and looked at the total population vaccination %. 1% chance of being hospitalized (dead within 15 years) because of the vaccine vs .02-.3% of covid death.
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I would like to know,
1. The size of the study group.
2. The rate of myocarditis or other heart issues in the unvaccinated population of similar age and physical condition (to establish a baseline.). Without knowing the baseline, it's impossible to draw any conclusions about the 1 in 100 study rate.
(12-20-2021, 12:22 PM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]All this for a death rate of...
0.2%
hey buddy. You can take your critical thinking elsewhere!
(12-21-2021, 01:26 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ] (12-20-2021, 10:47 AM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]Our WH is the best.
![[Image: 20211220-094645.jpg]](https://i.ibb.co/kDBmQP4/20211220-094645.jpg)
Since the non-GMO blooded won't be dying, look for the definition of vaccinated to change quickly to mean only booster every X months.
Wondering if travel will be shutdown. Doing it on Tuesday gives them time to dump or short airline stocks.
Study out of Oxford using 6 months of data shows 1 in 100 chance of myocarditis or other heart issues after vaccination. They took the hospitalizations and reason, then looked at the vaccination status, and looked at the total population vaccination %. 1% chance of being hospitalized (dead within 15 years) because of the vaccine vs .02-.3% of covid death.
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And myocarditis is a specific negative outcome.
We still haven't actually tackled the With/From problem for counting general COV 19 deaths and hospitalizations, so the numbers on serious morbidity are probably a lot lower than is being reported.
(12-21-2021, 07:41 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 01:26 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ]Since the non-GMO blooded won't be dying, look for the definition of vaccinated to change quickly to mean only booster every X months.
Wondering if travel will be shutdown. Doing it on Tuesday gives them time to dump or short airline stocks.
Study out of Oxford using 6 months of data shows 1 in 100 chance of myocarditis or other heart issues after vaccination. They took the hospitalizations and reason, then looked at the vaccination status, and looked at the total population vaccination %. 1% chance of being hospitalized (dead within 15 years) because of the vaccine vs .02-.3% of covid death.
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WWW.Facebook.Com
His uncles friend Burt told him!
(12-21-2021, 09:34 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 07:41 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Care to share a link?
WWW.Facebook.Com
His uncles friend Burt told him!
You missed your calling as a cheerleader.
The study and commentary I read said the following:
"To put the risks in context, the group estimated between 1 and 10 additional myocarditis hospitalizations or deaths per 1 million people vaccinated, but 40 excess myocarditis events per million following a SARS-CoV-2 positive test result.
As reported, rates of excess myocarditis events associated with a first dose were
2 per million injections of the AstraZeneca vaccine
1 per million for the Pfizer vaccine
6 per million with the Moderna vaccine
Following a second dose, there were 10 additional myocarditis events per million people receiving the Moderna vaccine and none among recipients of the AstraZeneca or Pfizer vaccines.
"It was particularly seen within the first 7 days of the first dose, which is very consistent with what we see in people who have viral myocarditis," Mills said. "So it looks like a real signal but it's very small."
The results are in line with previous studies of the Pfizer vaccine in Israel and studies of the Moderna vaccine in the United States, Biykem Bozkurt, MD, PhD, professor of medicine at Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Texas, told theheart.org"
Just seems like a pretty big difference between 1/100 and 1/1,000,000.
(12-21-2021, 10:30 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]The study and commentary I read said the following:
"To put the risks in context, the group estimated between 1 and 10 additional myocarditis hospitalizations or deaths per 1 million people vaccinated, but 40 excess myocarditis events per million following a SARS-CoV-2 positive test result.
As reported, rates of excess myocarditis events associated with a first dose were
2 per million injections of the AstraZeneca vaccine
1 per million for the Pfizer vaccine
6 per million with the Moderna vaccine
Following a second dose, there were 10 additional myocarditis events per million people receiving the Moderna vaccine and none among recipients of the AstraZeneca or Pfizer vaccines.
"It was particularly seen within the first 7 days of the first dose, which is very consistent with what we see in people who have viral myocarditis," Mills said. "So it looks like a real signal but it's very small."
The results are in line with previous studies of the Pfizer vaccine in Israel and studies of the Moderna vaccine in the United States, Biykem Bozkurt, MD, PhD, professor of medicine at Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Texas, told theheart.org"
Just seems like a pretty big difference between 1/100 and 1/1,000,000.
Over 250 million have had COVID, 5 million have died.
Is that worth all this stuff? Or should natural immunity just be allowed to run its course? Because all the vaccines seem to do is create new variants that just circumvent the vaccines.
(12-21-2021, 10:43 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:30 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]The study and commentary I read said the following:
"To put the risks in context, the group estimated between 1 and 10 additional myocarditis hospitalizations or deaths per 1 million people vaccinated, but 40 excess myocarditis events per million following a SARS-CoV-2 positive test result.
As reported, rates of excess myocarditis events associated with a first dose were
2 per million injections of the AstraZeneca vaccine
1 per million for the Pfizer vaccine
6 per million with the Moderna vaccine
Following a second dose, there were 10 additional myocarditis events per million people receiving the Moderna vaccine and none among recipients of the AstraZeneca or Pfizer vaccines.
"It was particularly seen within the first 7 days of the first dose, which is very consistent with what we see in people who have viral myocarditis," Mills said. "So it looks like a real signal but it's very small."
The results are in line with previous studies of the Pfizer vaccine in Israel and studies of the Moderna vaccine in the United States, Biykem Bozkurt, MD, PhD, professor of medicine at Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Texas, told theheart.org"
Just seems like a pretty big difference between 1/100 and 1/1,000,000.
Over 250 million have had COVID, 5 million have died.
Is that worth all this stuff? Or should natural immunity just be allowed to run its course? Because all the vaccines seem to do is create new variants that just circumvent the vaccines.
Of course, we can.
Please submit the name of a family member you're willing to sacrifice for the natural immunity effort.
Thank you,
The Natural Immunity Task Force
(12-21-2021, 10:52 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:43 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]Over 250 million have had COVID, 5 million have died.
Is that worth all this stuff? Or should natural immunity just be allowed to run its course? Because all the vaccines seem to do is create new variants that just circumvent the vaccines.
Of course, we can.
Please submit the name of a family member you're willing to sacrifice for the natural immunity effort.
Thank you,
The Natural Immunity Task Force
For a .02% chance of death? All of them.
Its these asinine comebacks that create this stupidty.
(12-21-2021, 10:43 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:30 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]The study and commentary I read said the following:
"To put the risks in context, the group estimated between 1 and 10 additional myocarditis hospitalizations or deaths per 1 million people vaccinated, but 40 excess myocarditis events per million following a SARS-CoV-2 positive test result.
As reported, rates of excess myocarditis events associated with a first dose were
2 per million injections of the AstraZeneca vaccine
1 per million for the Pfizer vaccine
6 per million with the Moderna vaccine
Following a second dose, there were 10 additional myocarditis events per million people receiving the Moderna vaccine and none among recipients of the AstraZeneca or Pfizer vaccines.
"It was particularly seen within the first 7 days of the first dose, which is very consistent with what we see in people who have viral myocarditis," Mills said. "So it looks like a real signal but it's very small."
The results are in line with previous studies of the Pfizer vaccine in Israel and studies of the Moderna vaccine in the United States, Biykem Bozkurt, MD, PhD, professor of medicine at Baylor College of Medicine, Houston, Texas, told theheart.org"
Just seems like a pretty big difference between 1/100 and 1/1,000,000.
Over 250 million have had COVID, 5 million have died.
Is that worth all this stuff? Or should natural immunity just be allowed to run its course? Because all the vaccines seem to do is create new variants that just circumvent the vaccines.
Mortality is not the only consideration. The long term effects of Covid, the cost of treatment for moderate to severe cases, and the care debt racked up in places where Covid is peaking are all significant factors contributing to the need to mitigate this virus as much as we can. No, the vaccines don't create new variants and they do contribute a great deal to mitigating all of those factors. The three countries where the Delta emerged (India, Brazil, South Africa) were all places of low vaccination rates and high Covid case numbers at the time it came out. Mutations happen when the virus can spread quickly through large numbers of hosts because the faulty copying of the cell's DNA is what causes the mutation, not Survival of the Fittest.
(12-21-2021, 10:54 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:52 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Of course, we can.
Please submit the name of a family member you're willing to sacrifice for the natural immunity effort.
Thank you,
The Natural Immunity Task Force
For a .02% chance of death? All of them.
Its these asinine comebacks that create this stupidty.
My mother posted a picture of her Christmas Dinner last year. Of the 4 people at the table she is the only one who is still alive, the other three died of Covid earlier this year. It's not asinine for the millions who've died and their loved ones.
(12-21-2021, 10:59 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:43 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]Over 250 million have had COVID, 5 million have died.
Is that worth all this stuff? Or should natural immunity just be allowed to run its course? Because all the vaccines seem to do is create new variants that just circumvent the vaccines.
Mortality is not the only consideration. The long term effects of Covid, the cost of treatment for moderate to severe cases, and the care debt racked up in places where Covid is peaking are all significant factors contributing to the need to mitigate this virus as much as we can. No, the vaccines don't create new variants and they do contribute a great deal to mitigating all of those factors. The three countries where the Delta emerged (India, Brazil, South Africa) were all places of low vaccination rates and high Covid case numbers at the time it came out. Mutations happen when the virus can spread quickly through large numbers of hosts because the faulty copying of the cell's DNA is what causes the mutation, not Survival of the Fittest.
(12-21-2021, 10:54 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]For a .02% chance of death? All of them.
Its these asinine comebacks that create this stupidty.
My mother posted a picture of her Christmas Dinner last year. Of the 4 people at the table she is the only one who is still alive, the other three died of Covid earlier this year. It's not asinine for the millions who've died and their loved ones.
If people believe that the vaccine will protect them, then by all means GET THE VACCINE. But to mandate it to everyone is fascism and scientifically makes zero sense. The vaccinated are transmitting the sickness at higher rates than the non vaccinated. Plus, there is NOT ONE DOCUMENTED CASE where someone that has survived COVID has transmitted the disease to anyone.. To recap, if you are vaccinated, you are supposedly protected and my deciding on whether or not to get the jab has NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU...
(12-21-2021, 10:54 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:52 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Of course, we can.
Please submit the name of a family member you're willing to sacrifice for the natural immunity effort.
Thank you,
The Natural Immunity Task Force
For a .02% chance of death? All of them.
Its these asinine comebacks that create this stupidty.
Unless you have someone in your family who is immunocompromised, or just happens to be a healthy person who the disease ravages for some reason.
(12-21-2021, 11:07 AM)Ronster Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:59 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Mortality is not the only consideration. The long term effects of Covid, the cost of treatment for moderate to severe cases, and the care debt racked up in places where Covid is peaking are all significant factors contributing to the need to mitigate this virus as much as we can. No, the vaccines don't create new variants and they do contribute a great deal to mitigating all of those factors. The three countries where the Delta emerged (India, Brazil, South Africa) were all places of low vaccination rates and high Covid case numbers at the time it came out. Mutations happen when the virus can spread quickly through large numbers of hosts because the faulty copying of the cell's DNA is what causes the mutation, not Survival of the Fittest.
My mother posted a picture of her Christmas Dinner last year. Of the 4 people at the table she is the only one who is still alive, the other three died of Covid earlier this year. It's not asinine for the millions who've died and their loved ones.
If people believe that the vaccine will protect them, then by all means GET THE VACCINE. But to mandate it to everyone is fascism and scientifically makes zero sense. The vaccinated are transmitting the sickness at higher rates than the non vaccinated. Plus, there is NOT ONE DOCUMENTED CASE where someone that has survived COVID has transmitted the disease to anyone.. To recap, if you are vaccinated, you are supposedly protected and my deciding on whether or not to get the jab has NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU...
I didn't advocate a mandate. The vaccinated are not transmitting the disease at higher rates, they are 63% less likely to transmit it than an infected unvaccinated person. There are plenty of documented cases where Covid survivors were re-infected, and also that those who remained unvaccinated after previous infection are twice as likely to catch Covid a second time as those who end up getting the shot. If you are vaccinated or survived Covid you have higher levels of protection than the unvaccinated though not absolute protection, which means you can still be a walking transmission vector. To recap, facts don't really care what anyone believes, and you're speaking in absolutes that make your statements incorrect.
(12-21-2021, 11:15 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 10:54 AM)TrivialPursuit Wrote: [ -> ]For a .02% chance of death? All of them.
Its these asinine comebacks that create this stupidty.
Unless you have someone in your family who is immunocompromised, or just happens to be a healthy person who the disease ravages for some reason.
Hey, that's their problem.
(12-21-2021, 11:46 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 11:07 AM)Ronster Wrote: [ -> ]If people believe that the vaccine will protect them, then by all means GET THE VACCINE. But to mandate it to everyone is fascism and scientifically makes zero sense. The vaccinated are transmitting the sickness at higher rates than the non vaccinated. Plus, there is NOT ONE DOCUMENTED CASE where someone that has survived COVID has transmitted the disease to anyone.. To recap, if you are vaccinated, you are supposedly protected and my deciding on whether or not to get the jab has NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU...
I didn't advocate a mandate. The vaccinated are not transmitting the disease at higher rates, they are 63% less likely to transmit it than an infected unvaccinated person. There are plenty of documented cases where Covid survivors were re-infected, and also that those who remained unvaccinated after previous infection are twice as likely to catch Covid a second time as those who end up getting the shot. If you are vaccinated or survived Covid you have higher levels of protection than the unvaccinated though not absolute protection, which means you can still be a walking transmission vector. To recap, facts don't really care what anyone believes, and you're speaking in absolutes that make your statements incorrect.
(12-21-2021, 11:15 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Unless you have someone in your family who is immunocompromised, or just happens to be a healthy person who the disease ravages for some reason.
Hey, that's their problem.
None what you replied to me is true, there is no reliable data to support that.
(12-21-2021, 11:56 AM)p_rushing Wrote: [ -> ]Here is the study of the data, there was no trial or test group, it uses the actual data from everyone in the UK for about 6 months.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-021-01630-0
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Right, and it shares consistency of outcomes with other smaller studies, so I think it's pretty solid.
"We estimate that the absolute number of excess myocarditis events in the 28 days following a first dose of adenovirus or mRNA vaccine is between one and six per million persons vaccinated, and the excess risk following the second dose of the mRNA-1283 vaccine is ten per million. By contrast, we estimate 40 excess myocarditis events per million in the 28 days following SARS-CoV-2 infection."
(12-21-2021, 11:59 AM)Ronster Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 11:46 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I didn't advocate a mandate. The vaccinated are not transmitting the disease at higher rates, they are 63% less likely to transmit it than an infected unvaccinated person. There are plenty of documented cases where Covid survivors were re-infected, and also that those who remained unvaccinated after previous infection are twice as likely to catch Covid a second time as those who end up getting the shot. If you are vaccinated or survived Covid you have higher levels of protection than the unvaccinated though not absolute protection, which means you can still be a walking transmission vector. To recap, facts don't really care what anyone believes, and you're speaking in absolutes that make your statements incorrect.
Hey, that's their problem.
None what you replied to me is true, there is no reliable data to support that.
There's plenty of reliable data to support it, it's your belief that's the issue and no amount of facts can change that.
(12-20-2021, 10:47 AM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]Our WH is the best.
That second paragraph should not be the message from the WH from any administration. That is not how you get people to listen. By now those who aren't vaccinated are likely not going to get it unless it's done by force and these people need to understand that. The more they push it the more resistance they're going to get.
I'm not anti-vaxx by any stretch of the imagination but I am absolutely anti-mandate.
(12-21-2021, 02:54 PM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ] (12-20-2021, 10:47 AM)StroudCrowd1 Wrote: [ -> ]Our WH is the best.
That second paragraph should not be the message from the WH from any administration. That is not how you get people to listen. By now those who aren't vaccinated are likely not going to get it unless it's done by force and these people need to understands that. The more they push it the more resistance they're going to get.
I'm not anti-vaxx by any stretch of the imagination but I am absolutely anti-mandate.
Ya, I read this earlier. Could you imagine if Trump released this or ANY Republican? OMG... Nobody takes this fake administration seriously, because of stupid comments like this. Its a clown show and the clowns behind the curtain are desperate.
(12-21-2021, 03:56 PM)Ronster Wrote: [ -> ] (12-21-2021, 02:54 PM)americus 2.0 Wrote: [ -> ]That second paragraph should not be the message from the WH from any administration. That is not how you get people to listen. By now those who aren't vaccinated are likely not going to get it unless it's done by force and these people need to understands that. The more they push it the more resistance they're going to get.
I'm not anti-vaxx by any stretch of the imagination but I am absolutely anti-mandate.
Ya, I read this earlier. Could you imagine if Trump released this or ANY Republican? OMG... Nobody takes this fake administration seriously, because of stupid comments like this. Its a clown show and the clowns behind the curtain are desperate.
Oh my, I agree with you again. At least the bolded bits. The double standards of the media is evident.
As for the blunt message from the WH COVID response coordinator, I guess it shows that the truth hurts as the unvaxxed got their panties in a twist over this one.