(10-26-2023, 10:16 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ] (10-26-2023, 10:04 AM)JagsFanSince95 Wrote: [ -> ]I mean, it's not for everyone otherwise every QB through there would be successful(See - Trey Lance) I think Shan is a top 5 NFL HC, so he would def cater to Trevor and he would find success there. It's crazy how so many Jags fans lack self awareness. They will drag me for harping on a less than stellar statistical season from Trevor, but Purdy has 2 bad games - 1 in which you could almost certainly pin both interceptions on playing through a concussion, and now he's some dumpster QB. Purdy will be fine, he is a good QB just like Trevor. I wouldn't pin either as great or elite. I would rank Purdy over Trevor right now though, he doesn't have the gaudy numbers and the pass offense has been - meh, if ETN wasn't having a career year and the defense wasn't 1st in takeaways and you had to rely on TL's body of work to win this year, we'd have 1 win. That's a fact. I think a similar situation occurs in SF with Purdy, hence why I think both QBs are good in the right situations, but you wouldn't ask either to carry your team because we've seen both flounder in that scenario more times than not. Trevor, to his credit, at least has the playoff game where he carried that team to a W.
edits
What is with this narrative that Trevor can't carry a team? Did you miss the Ravens game last year? Or the Cowboys? or the 1st Titans game? Or the Chargers games (granted he had a horrible 1st half but he certainly carried them in the 2nd half)?
You're just making stuff up as you go in order to be a contrarian. Purdy isn't even in the same stratosphere as Trevor and never will be.
I don't get it man. I'd be more than confident letting Trevor throw every down if we needed to win a shootout or a comeback win. It makes no sense to me how some people just don't see how good Trevor is
(10-26-2023, 12:45 PM)flgatorsandjags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-26-2023, 10:24 AM)Cleatwood Wrote: [ -> ]https://nflrankings.theringer.com/trade-value
Do you know where Trevor and Purdy rank here? Trevor is 5th on the list and Purdy is 35.....
Lawrence has 2 Pro Bowls?
@maybe they are projecting one at season's end.@
(10-26-2023, 10:04 AM)JagsFanSince95 Wrote: [ -> ] (10-25-2023, 08:06 AM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]The thing is, Purdy fits Shanny's system; if Lawrence was there Shanny would fit the system to him.
I mean, it's not for everyone otherwise every QB through there would be successful(See - Trey Lance) I think Shan is a top 5 NFL HC, so he would def cater to Trevor and he would find success there. It's crazy how so many Jags fans lack self awareness. They will drag me for harping on a less than stellar statistical season from Trevor, but Purdy has 2 bad games - 1 in which you could almost certainly pin both interceptions on playing through a concussion, and now he's some dumpster QB. Purdy will be fine, he is a good QB just like Trevor. I wouldn't pin either as great or elite. I would rank Purdy over Trevor right now though, he doesn't have the gaudy numbers and the pass offense has been - meh, if ETN wasn't having a career year and the defense wasn't 1st in takeaways and you had to rely on TL's body of work to win this year, we'd have 1 win. That's a fact. I think a similar situation occurs in SF with Purdy, hence why I think both QBs are good in the right situations, but you wouldn't ask either to carry your team because we've seen both flounder in that scenario more times than not. Trevor, to his credit, at least has the playoff game where he carried that team to a W.
edits
Lance started all of 4 games in SF due to injury. His first season he was a 97 rated QB and was 1-1 as the starter. That he was as good as he was considering he didn't play in college as a senior is a testament to the system he was in. That you put Purdy over Trevor says all we really need to know though.
(10-26-2023, 10:06 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-25-2023, 09:59 PM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ]The ultimate stat should be points per game for a qb.
If he leads a great drive and the RB punches it in - who cares. It’s still a great outcome.
That’s what I’m looking for. How many successful drives and points does our offense score? That should be the best metric for a qb.
Or you could attempt to analyze football players by watching them play football instead of trying to find the perfect stat to mislead you less than another one.
My primary issue with the little throng of Lawrence detractors floating about is that most of them fail to see the rare abilities he possesses that make him better than a number of other franchise-level QBs.
Of course we aren't seeing those gifts fully realized due to :- no pocket / bad protection
- Lawrence's own youth and ongoing development / inconsistency
But his talent is there to be seen if you look w/o bias.
He has put stuff on tape that you only see from the elite guys - he just isn't doing it every week yet.
It will happen eventually and all of this petty gnashing of teeth about his ranking or categorical classification will look stupid.
We’re just talking here. Of course I have my eye test and of course that contributes to the overall evaluation.
I also know that I don’t watch 16 other games every single week. I watch the jags and maybe one other game. So you can’t do a proper eye test to everyone, would you agree?
I think a quarterback leads the offense and the offense with the most points scored usually will have a strong qb. Are there exceptions? Absolutely.
But my point is - you can’t be an elite qb if year after year you’re middle of the pack or below average in points per game.
Trevor and this team is scoring points at a good clip and should continue to get better.
(10-27-2023, 06:41 PM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ] (10-26-2023, 10:06 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]Or you could attempt to analyze football players by watching them play football instead of trying to find the perfect stat to mislead you less than another one.
My primary issue with the little throng of Lawrence detractors floating about is that most of them fail to see the rare abilities he possesses that make him better than a number of other franchise-level QBs.
Of course we aren't seeing those gifts fully realized due to :- no pocket / bad protection
- Lawrence's own youth and ongoing development / inconsistency
But his talent is there to be seen if you look w/o bias.
He has put stuff on tape that you only see from the elite guys - he just isn't doing it every week yet.
It will happen eventually and all of this petty gnashing of teeth about his ranking or categorical classification will look stupid.
We’re just talking here. Of course I have my eye test and of course that contributes to the overall evaluation.
I also know that I don’t watch 16 other games every single week. I watch the jags and maybe one other game. So you can’t do a proper eye test to everyone, would you agree?
I think a quarterback leads the offense and the offense with the most points scored usually will have a strong qb. Are there exceptions? Absolutely.
But my point is - you can’t be an elite qb if year after year you’re middle of the pack or below average in points per game.
Trevor and this team is scoring points at a good clip and should continue to get better.
A, "year after year" is silly in TL's scenario - he's year 2 in a competent system
B, no, your points per game thing is still a flawed and convoluted way of interpreting QB play
The King of the South is the real deal.
(10-27-2023, 07:01 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2023, 06:41 PM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ]We’re just talking here. Of course I have my eye test and of course that contributes to the overall evaluation.
I also know that I don’t watch 16 other games every single week. I watch the jags and maybe one other game. So you can’t do a proper eye test to everyone, would you agree?
I think a quarterback leads the offense and the offense with the most points scored usually will have a strong qb. Are there exceptions? Absolutely.
But my point is - you can’t be an elite qb if year after year you’re middle of the pack or below average in points per game.
Trevor and this team is scoring points at a good clip and should continue to get better.
A, "year after year" is silly in TL's scenario - he's year 2 in a competent system
B, no, your points per game thing is still a flawed and convoluted way of interpreting QB play
The year after year comment wasn’t directed at Trevor. It was an example.
Well ppg is at least something objective and takes into account a good drive that ends in a RB touchdown (we’ve had lots of these lately). Better than Joe Shmoe’s eye test
(10-27-2023, 07:17 PM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2023, 07:01 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]A, "year after year" is silly in TL's scenario - he's year 2 in a competent system
B, no, your points per game thing is still a flawed and convoluted way of interpreting QB play
The year after year comment wasn’t directed at Trevor. It was an example.
Well ppg is at least something objective and takes into account a good drive that ends in a RB touchdown (we’ve had lots of these lately). Better than Joe Shmoe’s eye test
And yet watching Trevor put up play after play with what can only be described as suspect line play, making throws that are amazing tells me stats just might be overrated.
(10-27-2023, 07:17 PM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2023, 07:01 PM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]A, "year after year" is silly in TL's scenario - he's year 2 in a competent system
B, no, your points per game thing is still a flawed and convoluted way of interpreting QB play
The year after year comment wasn’t directed at Trevor. It was an example.
Well ppg is at least something objective and takes into account a good drive that ends in a RB touchdown (we’ve had lots of these lately). Better than Joe Shmoe’s eye test
ppg is something that you are trying to use to analyze QB play - and it fails to consider more than a dozen factors that could easily and often make it a horrible way to analyze QB play
I'll take my Joe Scmhoe eye test over your logic-fail stat column watching 8 days a week.
(10-28-2023, 12:20 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2023, 07:17 PM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ]The year after year comment wasn’t directed at Trevor. It was an example.
Well ppg is at least something objective and takes into account a good drive that ends in a RB touchdown (we’ve had lots of these lately). Better than Joe Shmoe’s eye test
ppg is something that you are trying to use to analyze QB play - and it fails to consider more than a dozen factors that could easily and often make it a horrible way to analyze QB play
I'll take my Joe Scmhoe eye test over your logic-fail stat column watching 8 days a week.
Stats aren't the best way to judge a QB I agree. Consistency moving the ball, ability to bring a team back and to be clutch in high pressure situations are more my thing. Was very pleased with Trevor in that regard at the end of the last season. I do still think he has a little ways to go before he's truely an elite QB but he's certainly got the potential to be that.
(10-28-2023, 12:20 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ] (10-27-2023, 07:17 PM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ]The year after year comment wasn’t directed at Trevor. It was an example.
Well ppg is at least something objective and takes into account a good drive that ends in a RB touchdown (we’ve had lots of these lately). Better than Joe Shmoe’s eye test
ppg is something that you are trying to use to analyze QB play - and it fails to consider more than a dozen factors that could easily and often make it a horrible way to analyze QB play
I'll take my Joe Scmhoe eye test over your logic-fail stat column watching 8 days a week.
how many NFL games do you watch every week?
(10-28-2023, 11:13 AM)SuperJville Wrote: [ -> ] (10-28-2023, 12:20 AM)NYC4jags Wrote: [ -> ]ppg is something that you are trying to use to analyze QB play - and it fails to consider more than a dozen factors that could easily and often make it a horrible way to analyze QB play
I'll take my Joe Scmhoe eye test over your logic-fail stat column watching 8 days a week.
how many NFL games do you watch every week?
6 or 7, plus the all 22 replays of the Jags
I watch condensed games on game pass to keep up with the league
Been doing so since that service existed - and I've been trying to figure out what makes good QBs good since Dan Marino
I'm confident in my Trevor Lawrence talent level analysis having digested a metric [BLEEP] ton of QB play over the decades. He's got some rare abilities that put his career trajectory on a really good arc moving forward and he makes throws lots of "good" QBs just don't or can't make.
I don't need to cherry pick stats to know what I'm seeing
Folks trying to call him a game manager at this stage are absolutely clueless in my book
Nothing personal - is what it is
Just three words:
Trevor is elite
I guess it’s better to be debating if our QB is elite or just really good rather than who we want with the #1 pick in the draft.