(04-11-2024, 02:42 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]https://twitter.com/CitizenFreePres/stat...EoPSg&s=19
I admire Chinese immigrants. Heck, I married one. But her guns aren't going to do her damn bit of good if the government, in her words, "becomes tyrannical." I'm not saying I'm in favor of gun control. I'm just saying that having guns in order to defend yourself against the government is pure fantasy.
There's no way you got your money's worth on that history degree.
Because I'm patronizing sometimes.
I'm never giving up my firearms..
(04-11-2024, 03:34 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 02:42 PM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]https://twitter.com/CitizenFreePres/stat...EoPSg&s=19
I admire Chinese immigrants. Heck, I married one. But her guns aren't going to do her damn bit of good if the government, in her words, "becomes tyrannical." I'm not saying I'm in favor of gun control. I'm just saying that having guns in order to defend yourself against the government is pure fantasy.
Haven't you been telling us for years that a small group of protesters, possibly armed with a handful of guns, came dangerously close to overthrowing the government on Jan 6th?
(04-11-2024, 05:40 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 03:34 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I admire Chinese immigrants. Heck, I married one. But her guns aren't going to do her damn bit of good if the government, in her words, "becomes tyrannical." I'm not saying I'm in favor of gun control. I'm just saying that having guns in order to defend yourself against the government is pure fantasy.
Haven't you been telling us for years that a small group of protesters, possibly armed with a handful of guns, came dangerously close to overthrowing the government on Jan 6th?
No.
(04-11-2024, 05:13 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 03:34 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I admire Chinese immigrants. Heck, I married one. But her guns aren't going to do her damn bit of good if the government, in her words, "becomes tyrannical." I'm not saying I'm in favor of gun control. I'm just saying that having guns in order to defend yourself against the government is pure fantasy.
It comes down to the ease at which a government could become tyrannical over a populace that was unarmed and with a mindset that being unarmed is virtuous, as opposed to an armed populace which firmly believes in the right to bear arms. That's important because the military and police, which would be the enforcers of that tyranny, come from the same populace. The same applies to government functionaries as well.
In other words, it's not so much about the guns themselves, but the mindset of the populace and the beliefs associated with gun ownership.
That could be more eloquently explained. I'm having a run-on sentence day.
So what you're saying is, delusions can have value.
The Battle of Athens (1946) says otherwise.
(04-11-2024, 05:28 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 10:09 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]I'm just using it as a timeframe. I'm not sure the day we first started sending them stuff, but Biden was President that day, and it's super relevant to your "point" because it was fully 6 maybe 7 years after they first got invaded.
I'll repeat it for you. Putting offensive weapons within striking distance of a perceived "enemy" invites reaction, and that works both ways. Let me know if you still don't understand.
A reaction happens after an action.
Russia invaded in 2014.
We gave Ukraine offensive weapons in 2021.
Let me know if you still don't understand.
(04-11-2024, 06:09 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 05:40 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ]Haven't you been telling us for years that a small group of protesters, possibly armed with a handful of guns, came dangerously close to overthrowing the government on Jan 6th?
No.
(04-11-2024, 05:13 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]It comes down to the ease at which a government could become tyrannical over a populace that was unarmed and with a mindset that being unarmed is virtuous, as opposed to an armed populace which firmly believes in the right to bear arms. That's important because the military and police, which would be the enforcers of that tyranny, come from the same populace. The same applies to government functionaries as well.
In other words, it's not so much about the guns themselves, but the mindset of the populace and the beliefs associated with gun ownership.
That could be more eloquently explained. I'm having a run-on sentence day.
So what you're saying is, delusions can have value.
No, that's not what I'm saying at all and I'm a little disappointed you would make such an effort to miss the point.
Let me expand on that by asking you: Do you consider your deeply held beliefs as delusions?
(04-11-2024, 05:40 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 03:34 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I admire Chinese immigrants. Heck, I married one. But her guns aren't going to do her damn bit of good if the government, in her words, "becomes tyrannical." I'm not saying I'm in favor of gun control. I'm just saying that having guns in order to defend yourself against the government is pure fantasy.
Haven't you been telling us for years that a small group of protesters, possibly armed with a handful of guns, came dangerously close to overthrowing the government on Jan 6th?
If the government is able to easily recruit police who believe you are a threat who must be arrested or worse, no amount of guns will save you.
If you are able to convince those police that the constitution is not being followed and no longer legitimate, and that they should follow you instead of their normal commanding officers, you don't need any guns at all. Even easier if the Constitution says that the elected officials have to perform a certain ceremony at a certain time or place, and you prevent them from doing so by causing a general ruckus. You get to be the crisis, and the solution to the crisis!
If they want to start taking guns away, take away the guns from the blue cities, since that's where the majority of the gun crimes are committed..
If you don't take away their guns, maybe take them away from democrats. That'll drop this country's gun violence.
(04-11-2024, 07:42 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 05:40 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ]Haven't you been telling us for years that a small group of protesters, possibly armed with a handful of guns, came dangerously close to overthrowing the government on Jan 6th?
If the government is able to easily recruit police who believe you are a threat who must be arrested or worse, no amount of guns will save you.
If you are able to convince those police that the constitution is not being followed and no longer legitimate, and that they should follow you instead of their normal commanding officers, you don't need any guns at all. Even easier if the Constitution says that the elected officials have to perform a certain ceremony at a certain time or place, and you prevent them from doing so by causing a general ruckus. You get to be the crisis, and the solution to the crisis!
There are less than a million police officers in the country. I think a well-armed public, with a 100 to 1 advantage, would do okay.
"General ruckus"? Thanks for dropping the insurrection talk and finally admitting what it really was.
(04-11-2024, 08:26 PM)Sneakers Wrote: [ -> ] (04-11-2024, 07:42 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]If the government is able to easily recruit police who believe you are a threat who must be arrested or worse, no amount of guns will save you.
If you are able to convince those police that the constitution is not being followed and no longer legitimate, and that they should follow you instead of their normal commanding officers, you don't need any guns at all. Even easier if the Constitution says that the elected officials have to perform a certain ceremony at a certain time or place, and you prevent them from doing so by causing a general ruckus. You get to be the crisis, and the solution to the crisis!
There are less than a million police officers in the country. I think a well-armed public, with a 100 to 1 advantage, would do okay.
"General ruckus"? Thanks for dropping the insurrection talk and finally admitting what it really was.
Your well armed neighbors would have to really like you and believe in your cause and be willing to stop their normal jobs and organize for that numerical advantage to mean anything.
And yes it was a general ruckus in the one place in the country during the one time every four years that a well timed ruckus can invalidate the continuation of the constitution. Which makes it an insurrection.
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