(10-04-2023, 07:32 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 07:22 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Sorry, I should have been more clear. What I meant was, "QAnon," although it was based on pure fiction, did have a lot of believers. That's why I say, if "Red Caesarism" rises to the level of QAnon, then it is a real thing that is kind of interesting, the way QAnon was interesting. And that's why I'd like to know if Red Caesarism has any traction in the public sphere, and if anyone else has ever heard of it.
Okay. However, I don’t think it had a lot of believers but the media built up a narrative that it did because it benefited their candidate.
If Red Caesarism gains any traction in the public discourse over the next few months is because the MSM is building another narrative to help their party.
It really is that simple.
There are a lot of polls that show a lot of people believe in the QAnon conspiracy theory.
QAnon Conspiracies Sway Faith Groups, Including 1 in 4 Whi...... | News & Reporting | Christianity Today
(10-04-2023, 07:48 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 07:32 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Okay. However, I don’t think it had a lot of believers but the media built up a narrative that it did because it benefited their candidate.
If Red Caesarism gains any traction in the public discourse over the next few months is because the MSM is building another narrative to help their party.
It really is that simple.
There are a lot of polls that show a lot of people believe in the QAnon conspiracy theory.
QAnon Conspiracies Sway Faith Groups, Including 1 in 4 Whi...... | News & Reporting | Christianity Today
“A new survey reports more than a quarter of white evangelical Protestants…”
This couldn’t be more targeted if they claimed it was left handed Peugeot drivers born in months that end in y.
I understand your point but the fact of the matter is the MSM attempted to paint a narrative that QAnon was a guiding force of the right. It was a looney conspiracy theory regarded as just that by a wide majority of Republicans.
(10-04-2023, 08:01 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 07:48 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]There are a lot of polls that show a lot of people believe in the QAnon conspiracy theory.
QAnon Conspiracies Sway Faith Groups, Including 1 in 4 Whi...... | News & Reporting | Christianity Today
“A new survey reports more than a quarter of white evangelical Protestants…”
This couldn’t be more targeted if they claimed it was left handed Peugeot drivers born in months that end in y.
I understand your point but the fact of the matter is the MSM attempted to paint a narrative that QAnon was a guiding force of the right. It was a looney conspiracy theory regarded as just that by a wide majority of Republicans.
Okay, I think we're going down the message board rabbit hole of arguing smaller and smaller points, but I really just want to know if anyone on this message board has heard of "Red Caesarism."
I think Q was more common than you're giving it credit, HB. Unfortunately, it's textbook cognitive dissonance. There are a lot on the right who had extreme faith in the American government, and they just couldn't reconcile how corrupt it has become, so they became perfect rubes for some trolls to convince them the government had a plan. It's not widespread among the right, but it did gain pretty good traction. However, using those people as a symbol of anything resembling the right is disingenuous. It's more sad than malicious, and, once again, it's the result of a government that's failing us, not their "stupidity."
(10-04-2023, 08:27 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 08:01 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]“A new survey reports more than a quarter of white evangelical Protestants…”
This couldn’t be more targeted if they claimed it was left handed Peugeot drivers born in months that end in y.
I understand your point but the fact of the matter is the MSM attempted to paint a narrative that QAnon was a guiding force of the right. It was a looney conspiracy theory regarded as just that by a wide majority of Republicans.
Okay, I think we're going down the message board rabbit hole of arguing smaller and smaller points, but I really just want to know if anyone on this message board has heard of "Red Caesarism."
No. They haven't. Much like every other media driven narrative that's proceeded it. I'm sure we'll be talking about it in 6 months, though.
I said this years ago, btw. The rise of the extreme left is going to produce the extreme right. Fascism was an answer to communism. The right will have to use the power of the state to defeat the power of the state. That's how it's always happened in history. So, "Red Caesarism" or whatever they want to call it, was always going to happen.
(10-04-2023, 08:29 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I think Q was more common than you're giving it credit, HB. Unfortunately, it's textbook cognitive dissonance. There are a lot on the right who had extreme faith in the American government, and they just couldn't reconcile how corrupt it has become, so they became perfect rubes for some trolls to convince them the government had a plan. It's not widespread among the right, but it did gain pretty good traction. However, using those people as a symbol of anything resembling the right is disingenuous. It's more sad than malicious, and, once again, it's the result of a government that's failing us, not their "stupidity."
(10-04-2023, 08:27 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]Okay, I think we're going down the message board rabbit hole of arguing smaller and smaller points, but I really just want to know if anyone on this message board has heard of "Red Caesarism."
No. They haven't. Much like every other media driven narrative that's proceeded it. I'm sure we'll be talking about it in 6 months, though.
I said this years ago, btw. The rise of the extreme left is going to produce the extreme right. Fascism was an answer to communism. The right will have to use the power of the state to defeat the power of the state. That's how it's always happened in history. So, "Red Caesarism" or whatever they want to call it, was always going to happen.
So if the right gets enough control of the power of the state to defeat the power of the state, what do they do with the power of the state after they have defeated it? Do you think the right will then give up the power of the state willingly? You say that's how it's always happened in history, but I can't think of an instance where fascism rose in response to communism and then the fascists gave up power. Spanish Civil War for example, or Germany in the 1930s. Fascists took the power of the state and expanded it.
And as for the phrase, "how corrupt it has become," the US government is no more corrupt now than it has been in the past. I'm not saying it's not corrupt, I'm saying it has always been that way.
(10-04-2023, 08:27 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 08:01 AM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]“A new survey reports more than a quarter of white evangelical Protestants…”
This couldn’t be more targeted if they claimed it was left handed Peugeot drivers born in months that end in y.
I understand your point but the fact of the matter is the MSM attempted to paint a narrative that QAnon was a guiding force of the right. It was a looney conspiracy theory regarded as just that by a wide majority of Republicans.
Okay, I think we're going down the message board rabbit hole of arguing smaller and smaller points, but I really just want to know if anyone on this message board has heard of "Red Caesarism."
Agreed. I’ll get off my Q horse.
Now on to Caesar!
![[Image: giphy.gif?cid=2154d3d7tl7kn8bafvsbv3wy2i...y.gif&ct=g]](https://media1.giphy.com/media/HuCz2swRUlfDq/giphy.gif?cid=2154d3d7tl7kn8bafvsbv3wy2ikrw41liiusy838uahn5ns2&ep=v1_gifs_related&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
(10-04-2023, 08:39 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 08:29 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I think Q was more common than you're giving it credit, HB. Unfortunately, it's textbook cognitive dissonance. There are a lot on the right who had extreme faith in the American government, and they just couldn't reconcile how corrupt it has become, so they became perfect rubes for some trolls to convince them the government had a plan. It's not widespread among the right, but it did gain pretty good traction. However, using those people as a symbol of anything resembling the right is disingenuous. It's more sad than malicious, and, once again, it's the result of a government that's failing us, not their "stupidity."
No. They haven't. Much like every other media driven narrative that's proceeded it. I'm sure we'll be talking about it in 6 months, though.
I said this years ago, btw. The rise of the extreme left is going to produce the extreme right. Fascism was an answer to communism. The right will have to use the power of the state to defeat the power of the state. That's how it's always happened in history. So, "Red Caesarism" or whatever they want to call it, was always going to happen.
So if the right gets enough control of the power of the state to defeat the power of the state, what do they do with the power of the state after they have defeated it? Do you think the right will then give up the power of the state willingly? You say that's how it's always happened in history, but I can't think of an instance where fascism rose in response to communism and then the fascists gave up power. Spanish Civil War for example, or Germany in the 1930s. Fascists took the power of the state and expanded it.
And as for the phrase, "how corrupt it has become," the US government is no more corrupt now than it has been in the past. I'm not saying it's not corrupt, I'm saying it has always been that way.
Mr. Smith Goes to Washington was made in 1939 and it is as true today as it was then.
(10-04-2023, 08:39 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 08:29 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]I think Q was more common than you're giving it credit, HB. Unfortunately, it's textbook cognitive dissonance. There are a lot on the right who had extreme faith in the American government, and they just couldn't reconcile how corrupt it has become, so they became perfect rubes for some trolls to convince them the government had a plan. It's not widespread among the right, but it did gain pretty good traction. However, using those people as a symbol of anything resembling the right is disingenuous. It's more sad than malicious, and, once again, it's the result of a government that's failing us, not their "stupidity."
No. They haven't. Much like every other media driven narrative that's proceeded it. I'm sure we'll be talking about it in 6 months, though.
I said this years ago, btw. The rise of the extreme left is going to produce the extreme right. Fascism was an answer to communism. The right will have to use the power of the state to defeat the power of the state. That's how it's always happened in history. So, "Red Caesarism" or whatever they want to call it, was always going to happen.
So if the right gets enough control of the power of the state to defeat the power of the state, what do they do with the power of the state after they have defeated it? Do you think the right will then give up the power of the state willingly? You say that's how it's always happened in history, but I can't think of an instance where fascism rose in response to communism and then the fascists gave up power. Spanish Civil War for example, or Germany in the 1930s. Fascists took the power of the state and expanded it.
And as for the phrase, "how corrupt it has become," the US government is no more corrupt now than it has been in the past. I'm not saying it's not corrupt, I'm saying it has always been that way.
Did I say the fascists gave up power?
(10-04-2023, 09:41 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 09:31 AM)Lucky2Last Wrote: [ -> ]Did I say the fascists gave up power?
No, you didn't. But you did say, "The right will have to use the power of the state to defeat the power of the state."
In order to use the power of the state, first they have to take control of the power of the state. Are you saying they would want to defeat the power that they control? It's never happened in all of history that the right, or the left for that matter, has taken control of the power of the state and then gotten rid of it. What they usually do is expand it.
It's like saying, "We need to blow up that house and in order to do that, first we have to occupy it." But once you occupy the house, why do you want to blow it up with yourself in it?
No. You're missing the point. If the power of the state is used by group y against group x, then group x must use the power of the state to defeat group y. It's the last measure before civil war. And, you are correct, once used the group doesn't give up power.
The moderates have failed their responsibility to push back against the power of the left (and continue to do so), which means you're going to see an uprising on the right making calls to use the power of the state against the left. It's predictable. You shouldn't be alarmed by this. You should have been alarmed about 10 years ago.
Welp, hats off to republicans.
After decades of trying, they finally ousted a house speaker.
And Matt Gaetz has now officially screwed someone over the age of 18, so, bonus!
(10-04-2023, 10:31 AM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ] (10-04-2023, 10:22 AM)WingerDinger Wrote: [ -> ]https://twitter.com/EndWokeness/status/1...qq3vA&s=19
You're so gullible. I'll bet they interviewed 50 people, and showed the two who defended shoplifting.
I'm sure the reporters interviewed however many people necessary to elicit the desired response. That's what the media does, both on the left, and on the right. Credibility (or lack thereof) in the media is a frustration we face every day. Regardless, wouldn't you agree that any percentage greater than zero of those supporting these actions is too high, and this "woke" tolerance is undermining the social fabric of our country?
![[Image: giphy.gif?cid=2154d3d7yngsqnuszm7qwb6zwd...y.gif&ct=g]](https://media1.giphy.com/media/4iKeimY0sahiQReGRh/giphy.gif?cid=2154d3d7yngsqnuszm7qwb6zwd5w6r076eoipzl61otyypgk&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)