(08-17-2024, 01:08 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 12:58 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]You should all be American. Culturally a western European society with Enlightenment values underscored by Judeo-Christian ethics. Economically a capitalist free market unhampered by government interference.
No you dip [BLEEP], a society that protects the rights of individuals through adherence to the Constitution in which they are enshrined.
Right, so if I want to complain that this society was racist from the beginning, and that black, female, and queer voices need to be amplified in the media, you would be happy with just boycotting me? You wouldn't want to do anything else to retaliate?
Where have you been dude. Has this not been going on for at least the last two decades?
(08-17-2024, 12:50 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 12:19 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I see Trumpism as protectionist, socially conservative, and isolationist.
But when you say "culturally unified," what do you mean exactly? Like we should all be Christian conservatives?
He's talking about a fantasy world where there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
And that's how it would be implemented. The only way it ever could be. Suppress and ignore undesired speech.
There are Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Latinos, Whites, Asians, and atheists who all subscribe to versions of this. They each think they get to be the ones in charge of implementing it.
You just described the democrat philosophy and playbook. Unwittingly of course.
(08-17-2024, 01:30 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 01:08 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Right, so if I want to complain that this society was racist from the beginning, and that black, female, and queer voices need to be amplified in the media, you would be happy with just boycotting me? You wouldn't want to do anything else to retaliate?
Of course, sunlight is the best disinfectant for stupid ideas. I'm a rights absolutist. You know this.
That's fine, but many of your fellow travelers would try for censorship if they got the chance.
(08-17-2024, 01:37 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 01:08 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Right, so if I want to complain that this society was racist from the beginning, and that black, female, and queer voices need to be amplified in the media, you would be happy with just boycotting me? You wouldn't want to do anything else to retaliate?
Why do they need to be amplified?
In other news, Trump has hired Tulsi Gabbard to prep him for the debate. This could get really interesting.
I don't know, but people say they do. And other people try to censor those people, get their books removed from libraries, get their shows removed from network TV, etc.
(08-17-2024, 02:45 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 12:50 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]He's talking about a fantasy world where there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
And that's how it would be implemented. The only way it ever could be. Suppress and ignore undesired speech.
There are Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Latinos, Whites, Asians, and atheists who all subscribe to versions of this. They each think they get to be the ones in charge of implementing it.
You just described the democrat philosophy and playbook. Unwittingly of course.
Democrats highlight inequality and try to sell themselves as people who can solve it.
Democrats make sure to over-emphasize diversity to the point where people believe that about a quarter of the population is queer when it's really more like a sixteenth.
They do try to get things they don't agree with suppressed but so do Republicans. Fortunately for now the judicial branch stops both parties.
(08-17-2024, 04:35 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 02:45 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]You just described the democrat philosophy and playbook. Unwittingly of course.
Democrats highlight inequality and try to sell themselves as people who can solve it.
Democrats make sure to over-emphasize diversity to the point where people believe that about a quarter of the population is queer when it's really more like a sixteenth.
They do try to get things they don't agree with suppressed but so do Republicans. Fortunately for now the judicial branch stops both parties.
The Right: I do not believe this appropriate for a 7 year old child.
The Left: Charlie Kirk is coming to our campus? We cannot allow this!
Yup, completely the same.
(08-17-2024, 04:42 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 04:35 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Democrats highlight inequality and try to sell themselves as people who can solve it.
Democrats make sure to over-emphasize diversity to the point where people believe that about a quarter of the population is queer when it's really more like a sixteenth.
They do try to get things they don't agree with suppressed but so do Republicans. Fortunately for now the judicial branch stops both parties.
The Right: I do not believe this appropriate for a 7 year old child.
The Left: Charlie Kirk is coming to our campus? We cannot allow this!
Yup, completely the same.
Thank you for admitting that what I described is not actually the Democrat playbook.
College administrators are not the entire left. Some of them aren't even left in the first place. They have a duty to draw a line of what speech is constructive to the goals of the University and what speech is not. I don't see how Charlie Kirk crossed that line, but that's between him and the University, not me, not the government.
I completely agree with efforts to keep displays of queerness away from kids, many on the left don't, but banning the library books for everyone is too far. I wouldn't want my public library banning the theology and self help books I prefer. The queer stuff just needs to be in its own section. But neither the left nor the right will accept that at the moment.
(08-17-2024, 04:48 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 04:42 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]The Right: I do not believe this appropriate for a 7 year old child.
The Left: Charlie Kirk is coming to our campus? We cannot allow this!
Yup, completely the same.
Thank you for admitting that what I described is not actually the Democrat playbook.
College administrators are not the entire left. Some of them aren't even left in the first place. They have a duty to draw a line of what speech is constructive to the goals of the University and what speech is not. I don't see how Charlie Kirk crossed that line, but that's between him and the University, not me, not the government.
I completely agree with efforts to keep displays of queerness away from kids, many on the left don't, but banning the library books for everyone is too far. I wouldn't want my public library banning the theology and self help books I prefer. The queer stuff just needs to be in its own section. But neither the left nor the right will accept that at the moment.
Your first sentence explains a lot. I pointed out an example of left vs right ideals and you concluded I agreed with you? Wow!
Let’s try another example. Which side shuts down free speech in the name of political correctness and which side opposes that?
(08-17-2024, 04:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 01:30 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]Of course, sunlight is the best disinfectant for stupid ideas. I'm a rights absolutist. You know this.
That's fine, but many of your fellow travelers would try for censorship if they got the chance.
(08-17-2024, 01:37 PM)homebiscuit Wrote: [ -> ]Why do they need to be amplified?
In other news, Trump has hired Tulsi Gabbard to prep him for the debate. This could get really interesting.
I don't know, but people say they do. And other people try to censor those people, get their books removed from libraries, get their shows removed from network TV, etc.
I don't know any Libertarians who support suppressing rights.
(08-17-2024, 06:56 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 04:15 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]That's fine, but many of your fellow travelers would try for censorship if they got the chance.
I don't know, but people say they do. And other people try to censor those people, get their books removed from libraries, get their shows removed from network TV, etc.
I don't know any Libertarians who support suppressing rights.
And I don't know any who wanted Trump to get away with all the times he abused his power. All of the ones I know say they don't support Trump, but none of them take his side as much as you do.
(08-17-2024, 05:18 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 04:48 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Thank you for admitting that what I described is not actually the Democrat playbook.
College administrators are not the entire left. Some of them aren't even left in the first place. They have a duty to draw a line of what speech is constructive to the goals of the University and what speech is not. I don't see how Charlie Kirk crossed that line, but that's between him and the University, not me, not the government.
I completely agree with efforts to keep displays of queerness away from kids, many on the left don't, but banning the library books for everyone is too far. I wouldn't want my public library banning the theology and self help books I prefer. The queer stuff just needs to be in its own section. But neither the left nor the right will accept that at the moment.
Your first sentence explains a lot. I pointed out an example of left vs right ideals and you concluded I agreed with you? Wow!
Let’s try another example. Which side shuts down free speech in the name of political correctness and which side opposes that?
You didn't address my points about inequality and queerness. So I conclude that you conceded them.
(08-17-2024, 08:05 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 06:56 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know any Libertarians who support suppressing rights.
And I don't know any who wanted Trump to get away with all the times he abused his power. All of the ones I know say they don't support Trump, but none of them take his side as much as you do.
(08-17-2024, 05:18 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]Your first sentence explains a lot. I pointed out an example of left vs right ideals and you concluded I agreed with you? Wow!
Let’s try another example. Which side shuts down free speech in the name of political correctness and which side opposes that?
You didn't address my points about inequality and queerness. So I conclude that you conceded them.
How do you draw these conclusions? LMAO
I think I am starting to understand your hatred of the Donald. You both share that narcissistic gene.
(08-17-2024, 08:05 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 06:56 PM)flsprtsgod Wrote: [ -> ]I don't know any Libertarians who support suppressing rights.
And I don't know any who wanted Trump to get away with all the times he abused his power. All of the ones I know say they don't support Trump, but none of them take his side as much as you do.
(08-17-2024, 05:18 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]Your first sentence explains a lot. I pointed out an example of left vs right ideals and you concluded I agreed with you? Wow!
Let’s try another example. Which side shuts down free speech in the name of political correctness and which side opposes that?
You didn't address my points about inequality and queerness. So I conclude that you conceded them.
Your sample of zero is immaterial.
(08-17-2024, 08:39 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 08:05 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]You didn't address my points about inequality and queerness. So I conclude that you conceded them.
How do you draw these conclusions? LMAO
I think I am starting to understand your hatred of the Donald. You both share that narcissistic gene.
Here's what I wrote:
Quote:[Elements of the right want a world where...] there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
Here's your reply:
Quote:You just described the democrat philosophy and playbook. Unwittingly of course
I was not describing the Democrat playbook. At all. And I explained the major difference:
Quote:Democrats highlight inequality and try to sell themselves as people who can solve it.
Democrats make sure to over-emphasize diversity to the point where people believe that about a quarter of the population is queer when it's really more like a sixteenth.
These are things that Republicans do not do. They do not embrace diversity. They brush over economic inequality and sanitize queerness.
(08-17-2024, 12:50 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 12:19 PM)The Real Marty Wrote: [ -> ]I see Trumpism as protectionist, socially conservative, and isolationist.
But when you say "culturally unified," what do you mean exactly? Like we should all be Christian conservatives?
He's talking about a fantasy world where there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
And that's how it would be implemented. The only way it ever could be. Suppress and ignore undesired speech.
There are Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Latinos, Whites, Asians, and atheists who all subscribe to versions of this. They each think they get to be the ones in charge of implementing it.
(08-17-2024, 09:10 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 08:39 PM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]How do you draw these conclusions? LMAO
I think I am starting to understand your hatred of the Donald. You both share that narcissistic gene.
Here's what I wrote:
Quote:[Elements of the right want a world where...] there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
Here's your reply:
Quote:You just described the democrat philosophy and playbook. Unwittingly of course
I was not describing the Democrat playbook. At all. And I explained the major difference:
Quote:Democrats highlight inequality and try to sell themselves as people who can solve it.
Democrats make sure to over-emphasize diversity to the point where people believe that about a quarter of the population is queer when it's really more like a sixteenth.
These are things that Republicans do not do. They do not embrace diversity. They brush over economic inequality and sanitize queerness.
“He's talking about a fantasy world where there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
And that's how it would be implemented. The only way it ever could be. Suppress and ignore undesired speech.
There are Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Latinos, Whites, Asians, and atheists who all subscribe to versions of this. They each think they get to be the ones in charge of implementing it.”
Here is your FULL quote. There is only one side that wants to sanitize history. There is only one side that suppresses free speech.
(08-18-2024, 03:20 AM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ] (08-17-2024, 12:50 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]He's talking about a fantasy world where there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
And that's how it would be implemented. The only way it ever could be. Suppress and ignore undesired speech.
There are Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Latinos, Whites, Asians, and atheists who all subscribe to versions of this. They each think they get to be the ones in charge of implementing it.
(08-17-2024, 09:10 PM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ]Here's what I wrote:
Here's your reply:
I was not describing the Democrat playbook. At all. And I explained the major difference:
These are things that Republicans do not do. They do not embrace diversity. They brush over economic inequality and sanitize queerness.
“He's talking about a fantasy world where there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
And that's how it would be implemented. The only way it ever could be. Suppress and ignore undesired speech.
There are Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Latinos, Whites, Asians, and atheists who all subscribe to versions of this. They each think they get to be the ones in charge of implementing it.”
Here is your FULL quote. There is only one side that wants to sanitize history. There is only one side that suppresses free speech.
Which side is banning books and preventing high schools from teaching African American history?
Which side just passed a law saying that employers can not lead discussions of race and racism during worker training sessions?
(08-18-2024, 09:02 AM)mikesez Wrote: [ -> ] (08-18-2024, 03:20 AM)copycat Wrote: [ -> ]“He's talking about a fantasy world where there is only one American culture and one version of American history and no need to do anything about perceptions of inequality besides suppress them.
And that's how it would be implemented. The only way it ever could be. Suppress and ignore undesired speech.
There are Catholics, Protestants, Jews, Latinos, Whites, Asians, and atheists who all subscribe to versions of this. They each think they get to be the ones in charge of implementing it.”
Here is your FULL quote. There is only one side that wants to sanitize history. There is only one side that suppresses free speech.
Which side is banning books and preventing high schools from teaching African American history?
Which side just passed a law saying that employers can not lead discussions of race and racism during worker training sessions?
No books were banned and the teaching of African American history is not prevented.